Podcast: Clutter vs Hoarding- How to Live Clutter Free

Are you drowning in clutter? In today’s podcast, decluttering expert Tracy McCubbin marks the 7 emotional clutter blocks that is able to hiding in your psyche and proposals tips-off to overcome each one. For example, do you have a basket full of unopened mail? Do you have an incongruou number of name-brand shoes collecting dust in your closet? And what about that expensive candle you’ll ignite “one” day? Each of these jumble forms is rooted in a different psychological jumble block.

Is there an country in your dwelling you’d really like to declutter? Tune in to hear all 7 psychological blocks and get some good advice on how you can begin your decluttering journey.

Subscribe& REVIEW Guest report for’ Tracy McCubbin- Clutter’ Podcast Episode

Tracy McCubbin has always referred to herself as “obsessive compulsive delicious, ” but who knew she could turn that feature into a booming business? Nearly ten years ago, while working for a major television director in Los Angeles, Tracy discovered she had the ability to see through any mess and clearly envision a clutter-free space. Coupled with keen time-management and organizational sciences, Tracy soon located more and more people were requesting her of providing assistance. Before she knew it, dClutterfly was born.

Ten times and over 1,200 professions last-minute, dClutterfly has been reputation “Best in Nest” by DailyCandy and has received the Super Service Award from Angie’s List for five years. Tracy is a regularly featured professional on KTLA Morning Show, KCAL9, and Good Day Sacramento. She and her corporation have been previously been featured in Real Simple, Women’s Day and ShopSmart. Along with her team of professional dClutterers, Tracy is ready to tackle any assignment, big or small.

About The Psych Central Podcast Host

Gabe Howard is an award-winning writer and talker who lives with bipolar disorder. He is the author of the popular bible, Mental Illness is an Asshole and other Sees, available from Amazon; indicated replicas are also available directly from the author . To learn more about Gabe, please visit his website,

Computer Generated Transcript for’ Tracy McCubbin- Clutter’ Episode

Editor’s Note: Please be mindful that this transcript has been computer rendered and therefore may contain blunders and grammar missteps. Thank you.

Announcer: You’re listening to the Psych Central Podcast, where guest professionals in the field of psychology and mental health share thought-provoking information using plain, everyday lingo. Here’s your emcee, Gabe Howard.

Gabe Howard: Welcome to this week’s escapade of The Psych Central Podcast. Calling into the picture today we have Tracy McCubbin, who has always referred to herself as obsessive obsessive delicious. She is the author of the newly published book Making Space Clutter Free: The Last-place Book on Decluttering You’ll Ever Need. And she is regularly featured as an expert in the media, and now she’s here on our prove. Tracy, welcome.

Tracy McCubbin: Thanks, Gabe. Thanks for having me. I’m super excited.

Gabe Howard: Well, it is my pleasure to have you. So it seems like decluttering, party, hoarding, it’s everywhere these days. About ten years ago, the television show Hoarders, I think was probably like the big flagship. But dwelling syndicate just seems like it’s really hit fever pitch. Why do you think that is?

Tracy McCubbin: You know, I think it’s the combined effects of our easy access to shopping so cheap consumer goods. Amazon delivers in a epoch. You can get your groceries, I like to joke, without even having to put your gasps on. Instacart will deliver straight off. And then also, we live in such a life of visual onslaught, Pinterest, Instagram, Facebook that we’re just being send these contents of how people picture our residences are supposed to look. You know, before it used to be a magazine, a newspaper or video. But now it’s like you appreciate the excellent home on Instagram. You see it on Pinterest. You see it on Facebook. You see it on the stores. You see it online. You know, there’s ten different channels coming at you. And I meditate people are really starting to take stock of how much substance we are really have and how it’s not really working for them.

Gabe Howard: One of the points that I noticed in preparing for this show is that you really talk about clutter. You don’t talk about hoarding. Now, is there a difference between hoarding and clutter or de-hoarding and de-cluttering? How do you separate those two ideas?

Tracy McCubbin: Hoarding is an actual ailment. I am not a therapist. I cannot diagnose it. There are a couple of huge riches online if you’re worried that you have hoarding illnes. For a long time, they thought that hoarding was a symptom of obsessive addictive ill. But in the last couple of years, the government has separated out as its own disorder. So it is an actual mental disorder. Clutter is just having too much stuff. So, and that’s not to say that there is one way that everybody should live. You know, I’m a single person. I live primarily by myself. I have a certain amount of material. A house of five is absolutely going to have more material than I do. But the nature that I describe clutter, Gabe, is that clutter is the stuff that does in the way of what you want to do. So, for instance, you want to have dinner at your dining room table, but you can’t because it’s covered with three, four or five days worth of mail, the kid’s athletics gear, a sweater you need to return to your mummy or you want to get dressed in the morning without having to pull everything out of your wardrobe. A mas of parties really get dressed out of their laundry basket because their closet is so full of drapes that they can’t retrieves it and use it as a tool. So it’s really the difference between too much stuff and then that substance that has already been — the jumble — you’ve written an psychological fib about. So you, “weve created” some tale about why we can’t let go of it. These are what I call the seven feelings jumble blocks. And we all really have at least one. Some of us have a couple more, but everybody’s got at least one.

Gabe Howard: And what are the 7 feeling jumble blocks?

Tracy McCubbin: So clutter block numeral 1 is what I call my trash continues me stuck in the past. You know, these are my parents whose kids have gone away to college, yet they still have their bedrooms saved accurately as a museum. This is us keeping drapes that we can’t fit into anymore. This is our stuff telling us that our best days are behind us.

Gabe Howard: And to a certain extent, isn’t that also where our retentions comes here, though, like how do you separate the stuff that remembers me in the past? Because they’re clothes that haven’t match since “schools ” and the stuff that continues me in the past as in genealogy heirlooms.

Tracy McCubbin: It’s when we attach to that. Right? When we guess, oh, I’m going to get back in those robes, you are aware, of course the family heirlooms are the things that you look at. You know, they compile you happy and they be borne in mind of your grandmother. I’m not saying that nonsense. I’m saying if you have a closet … I was with the client the other day and her linen closet, three of the shelves, the 5 shelves were full of artwork that her kids had performed in pre-school and elementary school. Her kids are grown ups now. They’re physicians. So this stuff that her kids have already established, which well, one or two of the turkey hands were fanciful. I don’t know that she needed all eight of them. Right?

Gabe Howard: It compiles sense.

Tracy McCubbin: These were sweetened, sweetened reminiscences. And that prompted her of it. But “shes had” three shelves in her linen closet that she couldn’t expend because she was stuck in the past. She didn’t want to let go of when her kids were little.

Gabe Howard: Construction perfect impression and then clutter block number 2?

Tracy McCubbin: Clutter block number 2 is my stuff tells me who I am. The best action to describe this clutter block is a client said to me with her hand on her hip. How can I maybe be lonely? I have two hundred duos of shoes. This is our identity. This is the designer names. This is I’m not lonely because I’m out at the sale at Nordstrom’s. “Its certainly true it is” expending our substance as our identity. I do a lot of senior downsizing, so I facilitate elderlies is removed from lifelong residences into smaller openings. And I see this a lot with my older gentleman who used to fix the car, used to do the handy labor around the house, genuinely identified as being a helper in the family. And now that they’re older and perhaps can’t get up on the ladder, it’s really hard for them to let go of who they used to be.

Gabe Howard: Emotional clutter block number 3. If I am remedy, it’s the stuff that you’re avoiding?

Tracy McCubbin: Absolutely, and full confession. I am a clutter block list 3, I have it. I exit a week without opening my mail. So this is not opening our mail. This is not paying our taxes. This is not doing the business of being a grown up. And the interesting thing, Gabe, about this, when the people who tend to be very, very successful at their task almost always seem to have jumble block quantity three, that they’re really, truly successful at work. But then when they come home, they forestall doing their grown-up stuff.

Gabe Howard: I completely agree with that. I feel that my date while I’m at work is when I am an adult and my time at home is when I can enjoy life. And a lot of the stuff that I’m avoiding is nonsense that I know is just going to make me unhappy. We’ll just go with I’m not even going to say angry,

Tracy McCubbin:[ Laughter]

Gabe Howard: Just unhappy, beset. So it can wait till tomorrow, right?

Tracy McCubbin: Absolutely, and also this is an absolute block because you think I’m so together at work, of course, I’ve got it together at home. I’ll get to that material eventually. So it’s this story that we’ve told ourselves. But what happens with this clutter block extremely, you are aware, this is the one that can end up costing you a great deal of money. Right? You don’t offer your taxes so you is behind in rewards and interest. Like this is the one that can really do some mar. Too, when that’s just put your big-hearted daughter heaves on and open your mail. Just get it on. You got to do it.

Gabe Howard: Now, this next one actually spoke to me personally because I think that I’m certainly guilty of it. So psychological clutter block list 4 is?

Tracy McCubbin: My fantasy stuff for my myth life.

Gabe Howard: I am so guilty of this.

Tracy McCubbin: Oh, tell me, what do you what do you fantasize you’re gonna be or ought to be?

Gabe Howard: So for me, I simply impede thinking that I need to hang on to certain things because I’m gonna required to in the future. You

Tracy McCubbin: Yep.

Gabe Howard: Know, for example, as soon as my podcast comes on Sirius Satellite Radio, I’m going to need all of this equipment. Listen, this equipment is not doing me any good. And when I’m even going to say when serious moon radio comes a announce, they’re not gonna want my shitty paraphernalium. But I only be suggested that if I get rid of it, I have limited my hand-pickeds. And that’s really the feelings proportion, right?

Tracy McCubbin: Absolutely.

Gabe Howard: Like, I believe that this stuff is connected to my success, even though you’re going to tell me that it’s not. And you’re right, by the way, you’re you’re so right.

Tracy McCubbin: And the great thing about that speciman, and thank you for sharing, is that, you know what, Sirius XM Radio has beautiful studios, beautiful paraphernalium. They have the best of very best. So while I love that, that’s a objective for you, like get the fantasy part out of it. Get to the reality of it. Again, this goes back to you’re not living the life that you’re living right now. You’re not joyou with what you have. You’re not are concentrated on, “This is the equipment that I are in place to do my podcast. And it labours. And it’s fantastic.” All this other trash I don’t use. But when I look at it, I prompt myself that I’m not where I want to be. Not definitely in a good way.

Gabe Howard: It becomes a stumbling block.

Tracy McCubbin: Absolutely. This one I view a lot around fitness rig. These are the people who run, you know what I required to be I need to be a rock climber. My life would be perfect if I’m a rock climber. So they got to get out and they buy all the equipment. They don’t rent it. They don’t borrow it. They buy all the equipment, the shoes and little pouches with the chalk. And then they get up to the rock and they’re like, I’m scared of altitudes or I don’t like this at all. And then they’ve gotten all this substance with this thing that they think they should be and they’re not. And then they get angry at themselves. Well, I should be. That’s. No. If you’re not a rock climber, you’re still a really good person. You’re still a lovely human. You don’t ever have to climb a rock-and-roll. We can really all descend deep down into this clutter block.

Gabe Howard: We’ll be back with the rest of the psychological jumble blocks after these messages.

Sponsor Message: Hey folks, Gabe here. I host another podcast for Psych Central. It’s called Not Crazy. He hosts Not Crazy with me, Jackie Zimmerman, and everything all about navigating our lives with mental illness and mental health concerns. Listen now at Psych NotCrazy or on your favorite podcast player.

Sponsor Message: This escapade is sponsored by Secure, handy, and inexpensive online advise. Our consultants are licensed, accredited professionals. Anything you share is confidential. Schedule secure video or telephone discussions, plus chat and text with your healer whenever you feel it’s needed. A month of online rehabilitation often costs less than a single traditional face to face discussion. Go to PsychCentral.and event seven days of free care to see if online counseling is right for you. PsychCentral.

Gabe Howard: We’re back discussing clutter and de-cluttering with generator Tracy McCubbin. And the next emotional jumble block is?

Tracy McCubbin: I affection this one because people break through this, I truly check them start to shine. Clutter block number 5, I’m not worth my good stuff. So this is parties with invests, with calls on them in their wardrobe. Oh, that’s too nice. I’m saving that for a special occasion. You know, don’t use grandma’s beautiful china. Don’t burn the smelly, expensive candle. There’s this someday far away time when all this nonsense is going to be relevant or it is the perfect day to use it. And you are aware, I live in California and we have just gone through another devastating round of wildfires and so many people have lost their homes. And one thing that I always think about is like what substance burned in those dwellings that they never got to enjoy? You know, if not today, when? Because we’re really not guaranteed tomorrow. Are we?

Gabe Howard: This one truly speaking on me a good deal. Our production assistant for this podcast. We’ve known each other for a long, long time. And she said that all growing up, her grandmother would tell her over and over and over again. This is for a special occasion. “Its for” a special occasion. We’re saving it for good, was why she said. And my friend cleaned out her grandmother’s home after she passed away. And it felt all of this stuff still wrapped in all of its packs, still waiting for good. And her grandmother’s life was over. So good literally never came. And it just made her reckon, wow. In my grandmother’s part life, she never thought that it was good enough to use, you know, this pottery, this tablecloth and these were small things, the things that she was saving for good were things that her grandmother, who had limited means and grew up in rural Ohio, could afford. And still, she never thought that it arrived.

Tracy McCubbin: I know, it really interrupts my centre. Right? You just think here’s this woman that I’m sure probably worked very hard and collected a family and you know of anybody, she deserved to eat off of that delightful tablecloth.

Gabe Howard: Right.

Tracy McCubbin: Just enjoy the feeling, like even if it’s takeout, Chinese or Thai takeout like burn the nice candles. So this one, when people actually cause this settle and they lead, you know what? I’m worth it. I just see them start to soar. I cherish it. I got a text from person the other day who read the book, she said. I’m just finishing up the book. And I illuminate the very expensive, smelly candle that I had never wanted to burn. And it just made me so happy. So this one. Great. And you are aware, the interesting thing about this one too, this jumble block is certainly passed down generationally. Like you were saying about your best friend, peculiarly if you have parents or grandparents who lived through the depression or the World Wars. You know, there’s a real hypothesi of moderation as a perfection and

Gabe Howard: Right.

Tracy McCubbin: That there will be better goes. So we’re gonna save it for that. So I think that sometimes this is a real sort of family constellation story, if that constructs sense.

Gabe Howard: It does, it does. Your family’s prices are your values. So if your grandmother thought that nothing in her life was good enough for the good china and the good tablecloth she transfers that onto, you where now you’re waiting for something to be good enough for the good China and the good tablecloth. And then you’re going to pass that on to your children. And we just need to break the cycles/second. You know, Big Macs are delicious. Put it on the good China, gave it on the good tablecloth and and and invoke a glass to your loved ones. Right? That’s why we work to buy these beautiful things to share with those that we affection. And that’s good enough,

Tracy McCubbin: And that we’re worth it. Right?

Gabe Howard: Right.

Tracy McCubbin: We’re importance the delightful substance, like wear this sweater that you love. Well, what if I get a stain on it? Well, then don’t buy it in the first place. But I think that’s so interesting because that all steps right into jumble block count 6, which is trapped with other people’s stuff. And this is really about this trash we literally acquire from people who have passed on. And talk about inheriting a fib. I have more dialogues/ heated debates about the value of something that someone’s great grandmother left them and she affirm that it was going to make them a million dollars. And, you know, I can’t get rid of this. You know, the secretary, even though I never use it because it was my great grandmother’s and she said it was a Louis XIV and I’m in to get a million dollars for it. And it lives in the garage and is being eaten by termites.

Gabe Howard: Right.

Tracy McCubbin: You know that we’ve told ourselves this story. And here’s what I will let the people know. Furniture is a diminishing asset. It is an instrument which you buy to use. It is very, exceedingly, very rare. Extremely rare. No matter what Antiques Roadshow tells you, it’s very rare that you’re going to sell furniture at a profit or even at penalty. So parties get stuck in this idea that this was worth something and I can’t let go of it. But this also, Gabe, this where the reminiscences came to see you, right? That we look

Gabe Howard: Right.

Tracy McCubbin: At this thing and we think about that person that we lost. And I merely did a speaking occurrence and this woman was talking about how she has a bag like a plastic shopping bag on her dresser that she looks at every morning that is full of the confines that were on her mother’s nightstand when her mother legislated. And she started to cry when she said today. And I said, well, does it prepare you happy to look at it? And she said , no, it merely ends my heart and reminds me of that night, but I can’t let go of them because I feel, And what I replenished in for her, do you feel like you’re losing her all over again if you were to get rid of them? And she said, right. And I said, well, why don’t you make a swap out when you get rid of the pencils and why don’t you find a photo of one of your favorite eras with her or a figurine or a knick forte that she cherished, so that when you look at it in that same locate, you think of her. But you remember your best days.

Gabe Howard: I like that a good deal. A lot.

Tracy McCubbin: Yeah, and I see, you are aware, the loss is so hard that we don’t want to forget the person. And I amply stole this from Dr. Phil, so I have to give him credit. He always says, you know, the amount of time you waste agonizing someone in no way wonders how much you loved them. And I always like to say the amount of stuff that you keep from someone who’s passed away in no way reflects how much you adore them. You don’t need to have a house full of furniture that you detest because it prompts you of your grandmother. You can have one thing that you love. And I think that memory is actually stronger and more cherished.

Gabe Howard: Now, the last feeling jumble block, if I understand it properly, I think in some ways is maybe “the worlds largest” relatable. It’s the stuff I retain paying for. Can you explain that to us?

Tracy McCubbin: This is the stuff that we invested money on. We know we’re really never going to use, but we can’t let go of it because we paid good coin for it. So “its certainly true it is” meeting our spend garbs. And sometimes you just have to admit you “re making a mistake”. Right? Sometimes you simply bought the inaccurate bag. This is the stuff that you retain paid under. This is where you just have to admit, you know what? I made a mistake. I made a bad decision. I don’t need to keep castigating myself over and over again that it was bad. Like let it go. Maybe donate it to somebody who can use it, but really don’t hang on to it because we are paid a great deal of money for it.

Gabe Howard: It’s almost like you’re pay twice, right? You’re paid under the initial buy and then by let it propped you back or remind you of negatives or in a number of cases it actually has outlays that move forward.

Tracy McCubbin: The immense illustration is off-site storage,

Gabe Howard: Oh, yes.

Tracy McCubbin: Those people whose garage is so full and mansion is so full that they are renting offsite storage for the stuff that they think they need. I personally are currently in, I don’t know, a thousand storage measurements. I have never once ascertained anything more valuable in that storage than they paid to place it. So it’s really, like you said, ongoing cost.

Gabe Howard: I cannot tell you how much I agree with that statement. And that causes me to my next question. So I imagine that everybody is going to find an emotional jumble block that they belong in and they’re going to think to themselves, I’ve got to let go of some of this nonsense. But now we’re stuck again, because as much as I would love to say, hey, time chuck it on the curb. People don’t like that impression. Do you have any recommendations of what to do with this trash? Now that we’re lastly willing to let go of it?

Tracy McCubbin: I do. That’s a great question. You know, I’m part Scottish, so I’m terribly thrifty and I believes in recycling and shortening and all that stuff. And here’s the thing about causing leave of it. There are amazing companies. There are the big ones, the Goodwill and the Salvation Army. But if you do a teeny fragment of due diligence, there are awesome formations locally that will take almost everything. Some of it is just trash and there’s no way around that. And as much as I hate to replenish the landfill. But for example, animal rescue companies, they will take your old membranes. They will take your discoloured towels. They go through that trash and it gets put to immense application. So it doesn’t precisely fill in the landfill, right? Really plummet a crate off to them. Old cases that are in good, clean-living, driving necessity. Bands that work with foster care, kids, you are aware, there are so many huge places to donate. That with time a little bit of research. On my Web site,, I actually have a resource guide to what I called intentional donating. So foreseeing a little outside the box and plazas that you are able to look in your own area.

Tracy McCubbin: So that’s a great resource for people. And too sometimes, just ask your friend, you know, your collaborator or your housekeeper. A enormous narration about this is a client of mine out here. Her mom very suddenly took a turn for the worse, must be given to kept her in facilitated life and was fixed with a houseful of furniture in St. Louis. She lived out here. Mom was in St. Louis. You know, I don’t time to do an owned auction. There’s a lot to donate. I got to do this really fast. And my suggestion to her is like, why don’t you exactly situated a assortment of images on your Facebook page? Can I call out to people in the neighborhood? Her family was from there and her first cousin’s kid was moving into his first apartment with his roommates after college and first employment and didn’t have a lot of money. They were like, we’ll take it all. Came over with U-Haul and a entire knot of young people loaded up and lay out their first apartment. So with a little bit of endeavour, you can find homes for a lot of staff.

Gabe Howard: I like what you said there about donating it to people’s firstly apartments, because I retain my first apartment was totally, fully furnished by hand-me-downs and I have such incredibly positive caches of that accommodation, even though my house now has much nicer stuff because my financial situation has changed and now I get to give the hand-me-downs so the younger people in my life are now utilizing my nonsense. It’s fun to walk into somebody’s house and watch the kitchen table that I bought 25 years ago now living in their home, it’s nice. Now when you donate to a donation, you don’t ever get to see that. But just know that it’s out there, right? Precisely known better your nonsense is available in the wildernes, producing happiness and utility to other people who can’t open it because they’re still young. So you’re giving them the paw up that we all get when we were younger. I think it’s a great way to pay it literally backwards.

Tracy McCubbin: Yeah. So I collaborating with a patron this weekend. She has twins and they were aging out of a whole bunch of baby material, right? They get all that stuff. They age out and her housekeeper goes once a month to work with a school in Tijuana. And she took everything. And, you are aware, everything was gonna find a residence. All that substance was gonna be put to use. And it just made my consumer so happy. You know, it realized us absolutely delighted. It was like such a full circle moment, especially for those of us who letting extend is a little bit harder. You know, some of us, we can let go. And jumble is not a problem. But for those of us who are a little more affixed, I always say, like, find the thing that speaks to you. Where do you want to give of yourself? Is it the salvage animals or is it foster kids? Is it the veterinaries? Whatever it is, if you give to that group, it’s your neighbor. You know, whatever it is, it’s gonna be so much easier to let go because, you are aware, it’s being put to good use.

Gabe Howard: So we’re almost at the end of the establish, and I have my final question, and I think it’s one that people are really thinking about a lot. So you’ve done it, you’ve said your residence is now clutter free. You’re celebrating, you’re unionized, everything is wonderful. But then something happens called jumble sneak. How do we is an impediment?

Tracy McCubbin: The jumble lurk is really about a couple of things. It’s about awareness of what you’re buying and what you’re bringing into your room. What I tell consumers is instead of saying, oh, I need this. I need this, start saying I want this. I require this thing. So then you realize that you don’t really required to. And then it’s also about looking at your room. Right? Can you clean up the apartment in 20 minutes or less? Can you threw everything back? Let’s go and get onto prepared for the next day or fellowship “re coming”. If it makes you more than 20 minutes to do that, then that jumble is truly starting to pussyfoot back in. But it’s a real tier of consciousness and awareness and a lot like dieting. You know, you could do the large-hearted fast and you can lose 10 pounds really quickly, but then you have to change your relationship to food to stay there. And it’s the same thing. We’ve got to change our relationship to our trash. We have to understand that we need to own our stuff and our material shouldn’t own us.

Gabe Howard: I love that, Tracy. Thank you so much better. Now the mention of your bible is Making Space Clutter Free: The Last-place Book On Decluttering You’ll Ever Need. Where can tribes find you and where can folks get your notebook?

Tracy McCubbin: . M C C U B B I N flecked com is where they can come and visit me. Book is at Amazon. Book is at Barnes& Noble. It’s on audio, if you don’t want any more book clutter. And then I’m really pretty active on Instagram. Tracy_McCubbin and Facebook, @ThisIsTracyMcCubbin. So I’m kind of all over the place and pretty easy to find.

Gabe Howard: Well, thank you so much and I’m glad we concluded you.

Tracy McCubbin: Thank you for having me, Gabe, and have a really lovely day.

Gabe Howard: You’re very, very welcome. And listen up, everybody, we need you to do a couple of things for us to support the podcast. Please rank us. Review us. Use your words and tell people why you like us. And don’t forget to share us on social media. We realize all the shout outs. And retain, you can get one week of free, convenient, affordable, private online counseling anytime, anywhere, simply by visiting you. PsychCentral. We will see everyone next week.

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